Relegation Dogfight Thread

[thewwfc]

So thankful of our GD, which is like having a bonus point.

 

[kieran_vale]

The Gas were never seriously in this but they can officially fuck off now with their hoity-toity 46 points.

Look at that festering cesspool of mediocrity though in lower mid-table. Yum.

Neil Harris' oops, <insert manager>'s Barmy Army are not looking so hot right now (well, can anyone in this mess be called "hot", but still).

Charlton are showing a nice line in mediocrity there with a string of draws - which if they could keep that utter middledom going till the end of the season, should see them trickle haplessly into another season of glorious third tierball.

View attachment 19821

I think you can remove Wigan and Exeter from the reckoning. There’s just too much that would have to work against either of them not to get over the line from here. In Exeters case it’s surprising given they never pulled the trigger on removing Caldwell, looks like the risk has paid off.

I think Carlisle, Fleetwood and us are done for. The final one you’d think will come from one of the next four up.

 

[AmberRich]

Things will likely get worse before they get better. Two hard away games in the next week, followed by 4 fixtures, that on paper are slightly kinder. Though I'm a little fearful that we are putting too much pressure on those games to get a decent points total. We should be capable enough to pull through, but the squad's potentially been so destabilised recently that I feel we are a complete unknown quantity. We need something or someone to galvanise us for this last stretch. A new manager bounce would be perfect.

 

[YEO YEO YEO]

Purely because Burton are a pain with giving out away figures, I want them down with Fleetwood.

 

[Floreat Salopia]

There’s a thread on our forum which shows some interesting and frankly unbelievable stats since Paul Hurst has come back.

Under Hurst:

Ball Possession Before Hurst 23rd Under Hurst 16th

Shots per 90 Minutes Before Hurst 23rd Under Hurst 2nd

Crossing per 90 Minutes Before Hurst 21st Under Hurst 2nd

Passes into the final third Before Hurst 22nd Under Hurst 1st

Pressing (DDDA) : Before Hurst 19th Under Hurst 1st


Paul Hurst and Shrewsbury Town just click. Nobody knows why but it clicks. I honestly can’t see us going down, even more so after seeing those stats. We’re playing consistently good football for the first time since Hurst guided us to 3rd and two Wembley finals back in the 2017/18 season. Just wanna complete the job this season and see if we can replicate that 2017/18 season again starting from August. Tough, tough ask but I wouldn’t be one bit shocked if we did. Best manager we’ve ever had alongside Graham Turner.

 

[Carver]

Carlisle fans keep saying they're the worst team in the division. They're nowhere near as poor as us.

We're bottom and you're not so stop saying you're the worst when it's actually us who are the worst and we're bottom of the form table too and 11 points behind you.

The table does not lie.

 

[kieran_vale]

We're bottom and you're not so stop saying you're the worst when it's actually us who are the worst and we're bottom of the form table too and 11 points behind you.

The table does not lie.

Aye you’re a bit more dogshit than us but then we did contrive to lose to you so it’s probably a closer call than you’d think.

Anyway here’s to hoping the money clubs like Wrexham and Stockport are out the way by the time we make our respective returns back to the 4th division again.

 

[valefan16]

Aye you’re a bit more dogshit than us but then we did contrive to lose to you so it’s probably a closer call than you’d think.

Anyway here’s to hoping the money clubs like Wrexham and Stockport are out the way by the time we make our respective returns back to the 4th division again.

Chesterfield will be there and assume they have a big budget.

Worry is Wrexham are making hard work of it and the wheels seem to be flying off Stockport so could conceivably have both still there!

If Stoke come down though it will be an unforgivable relegation for us and Flickers won’t this fan base back no matter what he does going forward.

Carols emotional post match speech to the box holders etc is also worrying.

 

[Carver]

Aye you’re a bit more dogshit than us but then we did contrive to lose to you so it’s probably a closer call than you’d think.

Anyway here’s to hoping the money clubs like Wrexham and Stockport are out the way by the time we make our respective returns back to the 4th division again.

And you beat us by the way so we're even there.

You have a good manager at least so you will want to stick with him whether you go down or not. L2 will be tough next season too because there will still be a fair few other wealthy clubs down there including us as we will be looking to go straight back up at the first attempt and we've started planning for next season already because this season has got away from us.

 

[kieran_vale]

And you beat us by the way so we're even there.

You have a good manager at least so you will want to stick with him whether you go down or not. L2 will be tough next season too because there will still be a fair few other wealthy clubs down there including us as we will be looking to go straight back up at the first attempt and we've started planning for next season already because this season has got away from us.

True we did. Mind you that relied on a comedy moment at the back from Carlisle which is now our trademark.

I think we need to do similar to yourselves in planning though unfortunately we have a number of players contracted for next season already so not sure how much can do with it. So far I’ve got two positives for L2 - firstly we should hopefully win more games down there and secondly an away day at Notts. Other than that I’m struggling.

 

[dannylad01]

There’s a thread on our forum which shows some interesting and frankly unbelievable stats since Paul Hurst has come back.

Under Hurst:

Ball Possession Before Hurst 23rd Under Hurst 16th

Shots per 90 Minutes Before Hurst 23rd Under Hurst 2nd

Crossing per 90 Minutes Before Hurst 21st Under Hurst 2nd

Passes into the final third Before Hurst 22nd Under Hurst 1st

Pressing (DDDA) : Before Hurst 19th Under Hurst 1st


Paul Hurst and Shrewsbury Town just click. Nobody knows why but it clicks. I honestly can’t see us going down, even more so after seeing those stats. We’re playing consistently good football for the first time since Hurst guided us to 3rd and two Wembley finals back in the 2017/18 season. Just wanna complete the job this season and see if we can replicate that 2017/18 season again starting from August. Tough, tough ask but I wouldn’t be one bit shocked if we did. Best manager we’ve ever had alongside Graham Turner.

One stat that wasn't on the list and just as telling is under Taylor we'd scored a pathetic 4 goals in 13 away games. Under Hurst we've got 6 in 3 games. The opposition now know that they will actually have to do some defending in home games against us. It's such a marked improvement in performances which shows there was enough in the squad if played in the right position.

Wild predictions I have us finishing on 53 points (15 more points) which should be enough:

Lincoln (a) - D
Blackpool (h) - D
Port Vale (a) - L
Exeter (h) - W
Carlisle (h) - W
Bolton (a) - L
Oxford (h) - L
Bristol Rovers (a) - D
Portsmouth - (a) - L
Wycombe (h) - W
Charlton (a) - L
Leyton Orient (h) - W

 

[Carver]

True we did. Mind you that relied on a comedy moment at the back from Carlisle which is now our trademark.

I think we need to do similar to yourselves in planning though unfortunately we have a number of players contracted for next season already so not sure how much can do with it. So far I’ve got two positives for L2 - firstly we should hopefully win more games down there and secondly an away day at Notts. Other than that I’m struggling.

I'm looking forward to hopefully being capable of winning again but it's just the utter tinpottedness of that league and football I'm not looking forward to.

 

[valefan16]

I’m not as worried about relegation as previous times in that we are not basket case levels and the club is light years from how it was in L2 previously… all be it that’s part of the problem…

£10 million the Shanahans have put into the club, investment we haven’t seen before but the mistake made was the “Championship Ready” statement and building the club infrastructure to be ready for it… which is great in principle but you have to still invest in the on the squad! We’ve gone from play off chasing in Jan 2023, to considering it job done and having enough to stay up so had a terrible January window and nearly got bitten and never recovering.

Same mistakes made time and again and i love Carol and all she’s done for us. Man City, the promotion season, I was even proud we openly backed closing down the season at our own cost in terms of play offs to protect the clubs who couldn’t afford to finish the season.

We have to bounce back quickly though and that means learning lessons, Carols open letter after the Orient shambles was poorly done and seemed to be critical of fans and a protection of Flickers, yesterdays tear ridden speech sounds like she’s struggling under the pressure a bit. It’s her first real test of fan unready and she has to get a handle on it. If we go down but bounce back and enjoy a great season next season no one will be complaining in 15 months but they can’t make mistakes again.

I’ve become bored of League One, it’s taken its toll the last 14 months. Losing 31 of 52 games in the league, boring football, lack of goals… little old Port Vale mentality at times when clubs smaller or a similar size like Exeter, Burton, Stevenage, Lincoln, Cambridge, Shrewsbury etc seem to manage to be competitive just fine.

It’s great being this nice club that other clubs look at in terms of how we are run and developing off the pitch, who Prem clubs want to send their decent players along to etc but it’s no good if we don’t win games.

I’m not the only one disillusioned by it all, many fans are starting to lose interest. Derby away sold out in 24 hours last season… we won’t sell out next weekend which is ridiculous.

Hopefully a reset in league two and we can come back stronger.

 

[kieran_vale]

I’m not as worried about relegation as previous times in that we are not basket case levels and the club is light years from how it was in L2 previously… all be it that’s part of the problem…

£10 million the Shanahans have put into the club, investment we haven’t seen before but the mistake made was the “Championship Ready” statement and building the club infrastructure to be ready for it… which is great in principle but you have to still invest in the on the squad! We’ve gone from play off chasing in Jan 2023, to considering it job done and having enough to stay up so had a terrible January window and nearly got bitten and never recovering.

Same mistakes made time and again and i love Carol and all she’s done for us. Man City, the promotion season, I was even proud we openly backed closing down the season at our own cost in terms of play offs to protect the clubs who couldn’t afford to finish the season.

We have to bounce back quickly though and that means learning lessons, Carols open letter after the Orient shambles was poorly done and seemed to be critical of fans and a protection of Flickers, yesterdays tear ridden speech sounds like she’s struggling under the pressure a bit. It’s her first real test of fan unready and she has to get a handle on it. If we go down but bounce back and enjoy a great season next season no one will be complaining in 15 months but they can’t make mistakes again.

I’ve become bored of League One, it’s taken its toll the last 14 months. Losing 31 of 52 games in the league, boring football, lack of goals… little old Port Vale mentality at times when clubs smaller or a similar size like Exeter, Burton, Stevenage, Lincoln, Cambridge, Shrewsbury etc seem to manage to be competitive just fine.

It’s great being this nice club that other clubs look at in terms of how we are run and developing off the pitch, who Prem clubs want to send their decent players along to etc but it’s no good if we don’t win games.

I’m not the only one disillusioned by it all, many fans are starting to lose interest. Derby away sold out in 24 hours last season… we won’t sell out next weekend which is ridiculous.

Hopefully a reset in league two and we can come back stronger.

She is one step away from going full Delia Smith at Norwich. Don’t see what all the fuss is about, one of the backroom staffs wives told her we’ll be fine. And apparently losing like yesterday is not us, yes it fucking is for anyone who has seen us this season.

Either way I’m not even particularly angry or disappointed about it mainly as just accepted our fate. What I will say is when we go down we had better be a playoff at least team next season or then I think people will really start to turn on her.

 

[Pompeyblueboy]

True we did. Mind you that relied on a comedy moment at the back from Carlisle which is now our trademark.

I think we need to do similar to yourselves in planning though unfortunately we have a number of players contracted for next season already so not sure how much can do with it. So far I’ve got two positives for L2 - firstly we should hopefully win more games down there and secondly an away day at Notts. Other than that I’m struggling.

 

[Pompeyblueboy]

And you beat us by the way so we're even there.

You have a good manager at least so you will want to stick with him whether you go down or not. L2 will be tough next season too because there will still be a fair few other wealthy clubs down there including us as we will be looking to go straight back up at the first attempt and we've started planning for next season already because this season has got away from us.

This thread is brilliant. Arguing over who is the worst haha

 

[Carver]

This thread is brilliant. Arguing over who is the worst haha

That will be you next season in league above.

Those Vale fans do piss me off though when they claim to be the worst when it's blatantly us.

 

[BRFC_Gas]

I'm looking forward to hopefully being capable of winning again but it's just the utter tinpottedness of that league and football I'm not looking forward to.

Yeah you only have to look at some of the teams in L2 to make you appreciate L1 struggles.
We were worst in the league for most of the game yesterday though, not sure how we are not lower we've been awful for ages.

 

[Carver]

Yeah you only have to look at some of the teams in L2 to make you appreciate L1 struggles.
We were worst in the league for most of the game yesterday though, not sure how we are not lower we've been awful for ages.

Because there is worse below you. Maybe next season will be your year to drop down.

 

[Randolph Haggerty]

Yeah I've just looked at your run in and it isn't anywhere near as bad as this would suggest. The next 4 games are massive for you. Barring the Derby game all are quite winnable

The only problem with our run in is that we’ve got to play them.
And we are terrible.
Utterly
Utterly
Terrible

 

[denzel ecfc]

I think you can remove Wigan and Exeter from the reckoning. There’s just too much that would have to work against either of them not to get over the line from here. In Exeters case it’s surprising given they never pulled the trigger on removing Caldwell, looks like the risk has paid off.

I think Carlisle, Fleetwood and us are done for. The final one you’d think will come from one of the next four up.

You what? We aren't out of this yet. Peterborough and Bolton next, we could easily be dragged back into it i

 

[kieran_vale]

You what? We aren't out of this yet. Peterborough and Bolton next, we could easily be dragged back into it i

Well you still have the likes of us and a number of others down the bottom to play also. Seriously you’re not in the conversation on this. You’ll cruise to the required points needed and I’m not convinced the safety mark will be as high as 50 in any case.

 

[Randolph Haggerty]

I’m not as worried about relegation as previous times in that we are not basket case levels and the club is light years from how it was in L2 previously… all be it that’s part of the problem…

£10 million the Shanahans have put into the club, investment we haven’t seen before but the mistake made was the “Championship Ready” statement and building the club infrastructure to be ready for it… which is great in principle but you have to still invest in the on the squad! We’ve gone from play off chasing in Jan 2023, to considering it job done and having enough to stay up so had a terrible January window and nearly got bitten and never recovering.

Same mistakes made time and again and i love Carol and all she’s done for us. Man City, the promotion season, I was even proud we openly backed closing down the season at our own cost in terms of play offs to protect the clubs who couldn’t afford to finish the season.

We have to bounce back quickly though and that means learning lessons, Carols open letter after the Orient shambles was poorly done and seemed to be critical of fans and a protection of Flickers, yesterdays tear ridden speech sounds like she’s struggling under the pressure a bit. It’s her first real test of fan unready and she has to get a handle on it. If we go down but bounce back and enjoy a great season next season no one will be complaining in 15 months but they can’t make mistakes again.

I’ve become bored of League One, it’s taken its toll the last 14 months. Losing 31 of 52 games in the league, boring football, lack of goals… little old Port Vale mentality at times when clubs smaller or a similar size like Exeter, Burton, Stevenage, Lincoln, Cambridge, Shrewsbury etc seem to manage to be competitive just fine.

It’s great being this nice club that other clubs look at in terms of how we are run and developing off the pitch, who Prem clubs want to send their decent players along to etc but it’s no good if we don’t win games.

I’m not the only one disillusioned by it all, many fans are starting to lose interest. Derby away sold out in 24 hours last season… we won’t sell out next weekend which is ridiculous.

Hopefully a reset in league two and we can come back stronger.

We’ll probably do what FGR have done though.
This time next year we’ll be staring at the conference.
How many of this current bunch are under contract?
There not many I would keep

 

[valefan16]

We’ll probably do what FGR have done though.
This time next year we’ll be staring at the conference.
How many of this current bunch are under contract?
There not many I would keep

We’ve almost done that before but with the youth lads coming through and a decent manager plus most of our better players under contract we should be ok. Even if they leave it would have to be for money.

We need more battlers though to come in. As bad as it is for us overall it would probably be hugely beneficial to the likes of Shorrock, Plant, Lomax and Dipepa. (Walter’s if he stays).

One issue is I think pretty much our whole back line is under contract mind!

 

[kieran_vale]

We’ll probably do what FGR have done though.
This time next year we’ll be staring at the conference.
How many of this current bunch are under contract?
There not many I would keep

From memory the out of contract players are Wilson, Uche, Massey*, Leutwiler, Cass and then if you want to include the likes of Walters etc he will be. Massey with the * as that was during the time DC banned announcing lengths of contracts but surely we are not that incompetent to have given him three years…

For what it’s worth while this group is bad for L1 I don’t think it would come to that point in the league below. We didn’t go down from there with deadbeats like Ricky Miller doing beak all the time and what was left of Pugh and Tonge and this lot are not as bad as that. FGR are an aberration, if you look at the others who went down last season they’ve done alright.

 

[valefan16]

From memory the out of contract players are Wilson, Uche, Massey*, Leutwiler, Cass and then if you want to include the likes of Walters etc he will be. Massey with the * as that was during the time DC banned announcing lengths of contracts but surely we are not that incompetent to have given him three years…

For what it’s worth while this group is bad for L1 I don’t think it would come to that point in the league below. We didn’t go down from there with deadbeats like Ricky Miller doing beak all the time and what was left of Pugh and Tonge and this lot are not as bad as that. FGR are an aberration, if you look at the others who went down last season they’ve done alright.

Exactly, and we saw what this squad largely did to the best team currently in League Two... all be it now minus Arblaster and Devine so theres not that worry at this stage.

 

[BRFC_Gas]

Because there is worse below you. Maybe next season will be your year to drop down.

Maybe. could say that about anyone though

 

[Luke Imp]

Fleetwood are on the cusp of having too much to do, they're 3 wins adrift and need to win 25% of their remaining games just to catch up. If we assume Cheltenham will win one of their two games in hand, which is quite plausible in their current form, that's then 10 points adrift with 12 to play.

Reading have played one, two or three games more than those below them so that could change quite quickly as well.

 

[valefan16]

Maybe. could say that about anyone though

Next Year will be tough at the bottom if the big spenders come up from L2 I imagine, Wrexham, Stockport should have a real go at this level, Mansfield usually spend well and of course Gillingham and MK as well sniffing around the Play Offs.

Whoever survives in that lower mid table area, Cambridge/Exeter/Shrewsbury/Burton/Cheltenham for example if they stay up are going to really find it tough going you'd think and any bigger clubs who have a bad patch may also be sucked into it.

 

[BRFC_Gas]

Next Year will be tough at the bottom if the big spenders come up from L2 I imagine, Wrexham, Stockport should have a real go at this level, Mansfield usually spend well and of course Gillingham and MK as well sniffing around the Play Offs.

Whoever survives in that lower mid table area, Cambridge/Exeter/Shrewsbury/Burton/Cheltenham for example if they stay up are going to really find it tough going you'd think and any bigger clubs who have a bad patch may also be sucked into it.

We only have 10 players under contract past the summer and the new owners have said they will back MT to put together his own team.
6 loan players will return to parent clubs
Apart from Evans, Taylor, Finley, G.Ward, Conteh and Martin im not bothered if any of the rest leave.
George Friend expected to be announced Head Of Recruitment so he will be a busy boy